May 2 also marks five years since the tragic events in Odessa. The victims of the fire in the trade unions Building began almost 50 people. The massacre of activists of “antimiani” staged by Ukrainian radical nationalists. Witness Odessa tragedy, Oleg muzyka told RT about his own investigation of the event, which he started because of the inaction of the Kiev authorities. However they obtained the information of the Ukrainian justice simply ignores it, said the Music. According to him, Kiev counteracts any shares of Odessa in memory of the tragedy, while Ukrainian nationalists even in Germany addressed his insults and threats.
- Reuters
- © Yevgeny Volokin
— Oleg, from the moment of the Odessa tragedy has passed five years. How over the years the investigation progressed? Who now is under investigation?
— Today, according to my information, and another 57 people are in detention. This is Odessa. But it is not only those who were detained may 2, 2014. It’s already 2015, and 2016. When they were accused of some silly attacks, which are still not proven. People sit without charge so far. And the main figures of the events of may 2 is Dolzhenkov and Meadow who were detained for the events in the Greek area.
The worst thing is that these guys were acquitted last year they were prepared to exchange as prisoners of war. Their group consisted, if I am not mistaken, four or six people. Someone released. Then there were the stories that those who were freed were taken from the courtroom in vans and dropped outside the city. These vans were being followed by Ukrainian nationalists. Many guys even beaten, they’re back in intensive care got. It is the Ukrainian liberation.
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Themselves Dolzhenkova and Nefedova was not released. That is taking them closer to the border, to Kharkiv, give hope that they can be released, and then again returned to Odessa. Take out the new charges has already been in treason and violation of territorial integrity of Ukraine. Just for the fact that they were participants of the rally in 2014 in the city of Nikolaev. And here you guys are again in custody and again waiting for some charges.
— Is there any evidence that maybe they were involved in some fights or something like that?
— No, the main charges for them were clashes in the city center on Grecheskaya square. And new charges is part in the rally in the city of Nikolaev. All.
— Is there any information about whether the court?
— You know, I am corresponding with the investigator of Prosecutor’s office to investigate the events in Odessa on may 2. And he said they have not engaged in this investigation, which is mainly done as a PR. He told me that will try to get some information.
The following people, with whom I have maintained correspondence, — Ruslan Forostyak, Advisor to the head of the Main Directorate of the National police in the Odessa region. It seemed to me that it can be some conversation. But his last answer was this: they say, everything is clear to all what happened there.
And for me, of course, a huge shock. The man who in the Executive branch, answering my seemingly accessible and understandable questions with some nonsense. So until then, judgment no. And one group “anti-Maidan” — is in the dungeons, in a prison, and the second group is the “protesters” are on the loose.
— It is known that there is a huge amount of video content, like throwing Molotov cocktails at the trade unions Building and beaten people, fleeing from there. Do you have any materials that can identify specific individuals, who did?
— I have a whole series of photographs of 300 pieces. Time-lapse where you can track specific people. All the famous Seva Goncharevsky who finishes off those who jumped out and fled from the building. There is a group of guys he wanted. And lying next to my brother.
And I have a single, as Goncharevsky beats, then comes back as goes forward, as he comes face to face with Sergei Gazelam (it is the leader of the Ukrainian Cossacks in Odessa region), as they say. And I have these photos and provided the investigators with whom he was in correspondence, and Ruslan Forostyak from the Main Directorate of the National police in the Odessa region.
And the answer is: “so what?” You know? And don’t even know what to talk further. All there is a document there, which can be very well to consider carefully. I can share these photos with anyone. In order to still ensure justice.
— What did your brother there in the House of trade unions? Was he with you?
— My brother (he’s nine years younger than me) always said, if the city is something to be such and there will come the Nazis, it is his city to protect.
And he saw, like many Odessans, all of what is happening on the TV because it was live. And came to the Kulikovo Field at the time, when we went into the building itself. That is my brother, basically, and had no time for anything to participate. I walked in the building. … Suffocation, a fire, and he jumped from the third floor, survived, but became disabled. I his fate was not known until 4 may.
— It turns out that suspicions about planned actions of the Ukrainian security Service justified?
— I for five years never cease to conduct its investigation. I’m reviewing the footage, talk to people, analyze what experienced and felt. And remain convinced that the action was planned that in the House of trade unions were groups of people before we went. I can’t say with certainty that they knew that we go in there. But I am convinced, they are considered as one of the factors that there are those who will not go to Kulikovo Field and will retreat to this building.
Another point — I personally felt poisonous substances. And those smoke bombs that I saw that fell at my feet, they are based on sulfur. Who as a child set fire to the sulphur, knows what it is.
They came into the building from the street?
— Outside flew into the window.
— That is, it was not “Molotov cocktails”?
— First checkers flew. Suffocation. Molotov cocktails were then thrown already.
— And whether there is somewhere in the video that pieces allowed?
I haven’t seen such videos. But they fell at my feet and was clapping, then yellow-green smoke, so thick that is 30 inches no one can not see, and asphyxiation. I started to panic, we ran. I’m his brother so lost in the panic.
Now I begin to understand what was created is choking: it was still the usual chloroform, which you can buy at the pharmacy. A mixture of fire and chloroform — it is phosgene, even worse poison. So when you look at the footage of their fallen comrades who froze in certain poses, I obviously shows that the people suffocated from gas.
The gallery
— Now re-invigorated the oligarch Igor Kolomoisky. Perhaps he will return to Ukraine after Zelensky will become President. He himself virtually admitted that also participated in the preparation of such violent acts. What we know about this?
— The most simple information that catches everyone’s eyes is billboards by “PrivatBank”, the head of which is Kolomoisky. It said: “10 thousand dollars for the separatist”. This is the first that was.
— These billboards hung until may 2?
— It was not until 2 may. In March, in April they were hanging. My colleague at work even joked about this Billboard, saying, “And if the Music is to bind the machine, how much for that?” It kind of was, but not a joke.
And the second thing that catches the eye: after 2 may, after the events of the Governor of the region was appointed the person Kolomoyskiy — Igor Palitsa, which lasted a year. This one does not hide it’s all on the surface.
— Can we say that what happened in the House of trade unions was a spontaneous accident?
My version is no spontaneous event. Because the authorities planned to clean up the Field of Kulikovo, and the Governor Nemirovsky gave them assurance that by may 9 the area will be clean. Therefore, even if this youth Odessa squad advanced to the center of the city, football fans and hundreds from the Maidan still had to plan to arrive on the Kulikovo Field, only by the evening.
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I will never believe that this wasn’t planned. Because that day I was on the Kulikovo Field between 8:00 and seen already at 10:00 there came the cars with the police. They stood in the center of the square, keeping track of what is happening there. I also saw people who were doing something on the building of the regional administration №2 on the roof, where there is a constant webcam.
— Photo or video is about?
We haven’t photographed. But there’s a man who filmed everything as he first told me. However, when I let him out in 2015 and asked for the materials, he replied, they say, sorry, Oleg, I have all the materials disappeared from the computer. I can hardly believe it.
But I have a specific witness. This Modey Anatoly Ivanovich, at that time Lieutenant Colonel, who was at 8:00 on Kulikovo Field, along with other employees. I gave him the escort of warriors, with whom he went to our tents and camp were examined for the presence of firearms, “Molotov cocktails”. At the end of their RAID, I spoke with him, and he said, “All is calm, you have nothing here.”
But that’s not to say that going to strip. Just RAID, checked…
— I repeat, it is three things. And the fourth fact — this is the night of the fire in the trade unions Building. When it became less smoke, but the building was dark. It’s probably between eleven and twelve o’clock in the morning.
When I lost contact with my brother, then went to look for him in the building. I turned on the phone, using it as a flashlight. And here I was faced with a group of nationalists. I speak Ukrainian move, that I own. And I heard they said, “So, are we done here to restore order. Now will come those who will collect the documents and phones.”
It sounded like that there were clearly demarcated responsibilities. Some cleaned the building, the second gathering of information. I personally heard it. So I can constantly offer the police and Odessa journalists as a witness. Of course, on Skype, because I can’t come today to Ukraine.
— How do you assess your chances of returning to Ukraine after the presidential elections? Maybe there is some window of opportunity, including for political refugees?
The first thing I always want to say: this is not Zelensky won, and people voted mostly against Poroshenko, they had no alternative. But faith that Ukraine has something will change very quickly, we do not. I watch all the performances Zelensky, the statements of his team. There are no encouraging statements. Lasts almost the same rhetoric. Because Ukrainian nationalists will not give him in the first months of government to deploy a campaign that is different from the previous course. But the role of personality in history still has not been expunged. If he has enough forces to change something, then… God forbid.
I often ask myself this question: how do I get back to Odessa, if, God willing, there will be some changes? How will I meet on the street with the same Seva Goncharevsky who finished my friends, Chudakom who shot a gun at police officers and our supporters, mark Gordienko, Gualaca, Verkhovna Rada Deputy Alexey Goncharenko? I don’t know. Desire, of course, to answer for their actions and suffered some punishment there.
You know, I asked my brother, who is now in Odessa: “You meet these people who are guilty that you are disabled, what killed the inhabitants of Odessa? What do you feel?” And he said she didn’t feel him nothing, he has no hatred for them. I was glad that he didn’t hard soul.
At the same time, many times here in Germany, I was approached by supporters of the current Ukrainian government, I don’t know, poked a finger at me and said, “And it is a pity that you were not burned.” And I asked them: “have We met? Somewhere crossed?” They say: “No, but to burn you need”.
— So it turns out that evil has triumphed and nothing can be done?
— It is not done, it is temporary. But what we’re losing every day, hour, now, and five years is a fact. Because there is a specific propaganda. The boys, who were 12-13 years old, today already 18 years old, they are crammed with this ideology.
I have friends, they have relatives living in Crimea. In their family three sons, two last 25-30 years, and they understand what happened, communicate with the Crimean relatives. But the third son, who was 12 years old, who does not believe in what he is told from the Crimea. Here, the three brothers…
Do not believe that we will integrity of Ukraine after this nightmare, such hopes, illusions I have less and less. I, of course, see the example of Yugoslavia, that is, that Ukraine will also be dismembered. But it is already, in principle, not the whole. And the last laws of the Ukrainian language Kiev again rejects the Donbass, South-East.
But on may 9, 2019, we will see that the monument to the Unknown Sailor will come again thousands and thousands of citizens of Odessa. And on may 2 in memory of the tragic events in Odessa on Kulikovo Field thousands. The current Ukrainian government and police are asking citizens not to come, declare that there can be provocations. They are afraid of even just the fact that Odessa can go to remember the victims.
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— Now, about your activities in Germany. You are one of the authors of the book, which is now in your hands. Heard that already more than one hundred events you have organized about Odessa. How to react to it in Europe?
— Yes, for these five years, I visited 18 States and cities even more. And as a result of this all my activities (participation in various forums, discussions, meetings, demonstrations, pickets) to our book. I am not the author. Authors are the Germans. Just here there are three sections where I give interviews. And talk about what happened in 2014, and for the past five years. This book is called “on 2 may, Odessa. Five years later”.
Since I’m in Germany, of course, more meetings taking place there. The German audience is very much actively involved in discussions, meetings. Maybe it’s even a trace in history. This people had to endure fascism, and they know how it all ends, such nationalism after the creation of the new state. In second place — Italy. There are also very actively participate in all activities that we organize. More precisely, people organize, and I was invited to go.